The Cutting Edge of Conveying and Sorting Technology

Patrick Daly:

Hello, this is Patrick Daly, and welcome to Interlinks. Interlinks is a programme about connections, international business supply chains, and globalisation, and their effects on our life, our work, and our travel over recent years. Today on the show, we’ll be talking to Juan Vicente Sanchis, who’s the CEO at Vector Conveyors in Valencia, Spain, and Juane Emilio Tudela, who is the business development consultant with the company Cellumation. He is based in Valencia, Spain. So both Juans, Juan V. and Juane E., work in the world of materials handling, conveying, and sorting, and they work at the edge of innovation in the sector with clients, customers across multiple sectors in manufacturing and distribution. Now, there’s a very close connection between Vector Conveyors, which is a Spanish-registered company, and Cellumation, GmbH, which is a German-registered company. And Juan V. and Juane E. will explain this to us presently. So welcome, Juan Vicente.

Juan Vicente Sanchís:

Hi, Patrick. Thank you very much for inviting me.

Patrick Daly:

And welcome also to Juane Emilio.

Juane Tudela:

Thanks very much, Patrick, and good afternoon.

Patrick Daly:

So thank you very much, both of you, for being here with us today. So to kick off, Juane Emilio, start with you. Could you give me a quick overview of your career to date, and how did you get to be where you are today?

Juane Tudela:

Okay, so to be where I am today, I mean, when we’re talking about my working lifespan, it extends more than dangerously go into 25 years. So I rather stick to 20 years, but today-

Patrick Daly:

You don’t look old enough for that.

Juane Tudela:

Okay. Yeah, but it doesn’t look old. But when you do the calculations, the things don’t lie. So the thing is that today to be as a consultant for new business development for Cellumation, it is just like Cellumation got in touch with me because they wanted to do business development in America. So they trust my capabilities, because I mean, I’ve always been working with the South America in business development. So actually, the energy flow really, really good. And that was so easy that I decided to start where I was working, and just join the team. And since then, I’m working as a consultant for them. I’m also self-employed. And yeah, I mean, it’s three months that I’m working with them, and it’s just all going great. So-

Patrick Daly:

Excellent.

Juane Tudela:

… that’s a bit my story for the last three months.

Patrick Daly:

Okay. And Juan V., you’re the CEO of Vector Conveyors. So what’s the overview of your career, and how did you come to be CEO of this company?

Juan Vicente Sanchís:

Okay. We ran this company in 2017, but really, we have a lot of experience in the world of industry, but not in the manufacturer, the complete line of conveyors and sorting lines. We began in the past with my partners here in VCON. Our beginning was that to sell replacement in the industry of the conveyors, to sell DVC belts, motor belts, and industrial chain and other things. But the [inaudible 00:04:06] is there, but our customers is asking us for the conveyors. And we ran this company in 2017. And finally, we grow step by step in VCON. And actually, we can automize all different types of process that the industry of the logistic, on automotive, food. Yeah.

Patrick Daly:

What kind of customers does VCON, you say VCON, so Vector Conveyors is VCON?

Juan Vicente Sanchís:

Yes, sorry.

Patrick Daly:

Yeah, so that company, what kind of customers do you have, and what sectors and what kind of businesses are they in?

Juan Vicente Sanchís:

When we began to go to the market, to be honest, the main industry was food industry. But was thanks to Cellumation that introduced to the logistic market. And actually, 90% of our manufacture is for a logistic, and the other is automotive and food industry.

Patrick Daly:

And Juane E., in your role now as an independent or autonomous consultant, what’s your role? What’s your responsibilities and what are you doing day-to-day?

Juane Tudela:

Well, as I said before, when Cellumation got in touch with me, the aim was to establish and get to know their technology in the South American markets. So as I’ve always been doing business development, so they just saw me if I could do it. So I did. And basically, my daily duties is contacting people, being very active on social media, making presentations, show business cases, show success cases. And again, the same day, being very active, do the follow-up, and being really consistent, and being really persistent into what I like to say, making the Cellumation technology democratic to everybody. And how to say that?

And everybody at least has the chance to get to know to this new technology, because everything, when it’s new, you really need to trust it. I mean, sometimes many people like to stick to the old systems, so bring in something new. Either you like it, either they make you do a step back. So I’m actually trying to change this over and really bring Cellumation technology really strong into the South American market. And it takes a lot of time, it takes a lot of efforts, but I think we’re in the right way.

Patrick Daly:

So Juan V., what is the connection and the relationship between VCON, or Vector Conveyors, on the one hand, which is a Spanish company, and Cellumation GmbH, which is a German company? So what’s the connection between those two?

Juan Vicente Sanchís:

Our connection is for a long time, it’s seven years ago. We are looking for a new technology in internet, in YouTube. I remember that I can see a new technology in one video, and it was for Cellumation. And I wrote several emails to Claudio, that now is my partner. And finally, we went to Bremen to meet with the people of Cellumation. And finally, now currently, we are shareholders from Cellumation. That is very strange, because it’s something that we are not looking to do this role in information. I just want to be a distributor here in Spain to this new technology, but really, we have a big confidence with this technology. And finally, we can invest in this company. And this is our main relationship with Cellumation.

Patrick Daly:

Okay. So in effect, Vector Conveyors, the Spanish company, has invested in and part owns the German company called Cellumation. Is that correct?

Juan Vicente Sanchís:

Exactly. It’s correct. That is extreme, some extreme, because normally, the German company invests in some companies in Spain or other countries. But now, is to the other way. Is-

Patrick Daly:

The other way around, yeah.

Juan Vicente Sanchís:

Yeah, it is. [inaudible 00:09:36]

Patrick Daly:

Sometimes it happens that way.

Juan Vicente Sanchís:

But it is. But really, we are very happy, because I know that we are a good technology. Juane E. can explain better than me what is the technology that we use, but really, we are very happy to do this relationship with the people of Cellumation. And at the same time, I’m very happy to help to the people of Cellumation, because the people of Cellumation is people that is developing software and students, but they have not experience in the industry that we have here in Spain. And I think that we have a good team to develop software, and for our side, develop new projects and new markets. And really, I’m very happy to the relation.

Patrick Daly:

And Juane E., what’s unique about the Cellumation technology? And what can you do with it that is difficult or impossible to do with the older or the conventional technology?

Juane Tudela:

Well, actually, Cellumation, I mean, what it’s unique, it’s that it’s a modular compact system. And it’s working, it’s software-based, which is not like the old systems that are more like in EO signal-based. And they work omnidirectional. They work with three wheels in a kind of hexagonal cell, that it’s like a hive. And it’s also working on continuously flow. So for distribution centres, for sorting, for intralogistics, it really helps us, how to say that? You really get all parcels tracked. For most of our equipment, we are also using a vision system that really keeps track of every parcel that is going through the material flow. And it reacts. So actually, when we say that we are doing the smart equipment, it’s because we are manufacturing the smart equipment. We’ve got one equipment that can do everything that is needed at the moment in the entire logistics industry.

So what we say also is one equipment makes all, because it’s the hardware that does not change. It’s the software. It’s like they say, the mind of the machine that changes. So this is something that wasn’t present in the market before. So our machines really, I mean, I think what I always say is that they know what they’re doing. Our machines know what they’re doing. In a continuous flow, a lot of materials, a lot of parcels. And that you can keep track of everything, doing a lot of movements like rotating, diverting, turning.

Things that needed really a big area or a big surface to do all that, now it can all be done in a very small area, and can do a lot of things when going into palletizing, de-palletizing, diverting, rotating, singulating, which is essential in distribution centres and sorting lines. So it really can do all. That is what is unique. You don’t really need to have so many equipment doing one thing at a time. So you can actually programme our equipment to do a lot of things in a really small area, and keep track of every parcel at the same time. So it’s a lot of things into the same hardware, and based on the best software available in the market. So that it was unique. It is really a breakthrough. It’s a technological breakthrough.

Patrick Daly:

Excellent. So Juan V., what further developments are underway in the business in your sector, whether it be conveying or sorting, or transporting in intralogistics that we might see becoming mainstream in the coming years?

Juan Vicente Sanchís:

Really, I think that the robotic sorting is one of the process that the people want to invest more. And I think this is the process that the equipment can grow, because the autonomous robot in the future will be, I think that the best option to be flexible and scalable. And this is one of the things that I think that is really exploding into next year. And now is really, but I think that in the next year, there is a lot of different companies working with this type of robotic sorting, and I think this was the best option for the future.

And then all of the things that I think that we can grow is the software. Software always is growing step by step, and it’s a lot of people of different companies developing software for different things. But in our case, for example, we are developing software for tracking. And this mean that we are manufacturing for sorting lines. And we know all the difficulties to track the parcel. That if in the middle of the line of the sorting, the parcel is stopped for something or someone, or maybe having something that is not that you are happen, and then all the line is necessary to solve and to restart. And this is several times that you need a lot of waste time.

And now we are working on this type of software that to have a real tracking of the box of the item in every second that we need to know “Where is the parcel?” Because to this way, we can do best the process. And we want to avoid the stop of the lines. And maybe we can go down the speed of the line. And then without any type of restart, the line can be growing the speed all the time. And finally, to do the correct or the right sorting.

Patrick Daly:

Okay. And Juane E., you spend quite a lot of time talking to customers and prospects around the place. So what trends are you seeing among customers with regard to their policies for investing in mechanisation and automation? And how is the labour market in this post-COVID world influencing their thinking on this?

Juane Tudela:

Well, I can bring my experience into what I’m seeing nowadays in the South American market, mainly Brazil market. Brazil market for distribution centres and e-commerce, for instance, is growing exponentially. Also because I mean, there’s been a company that is only 20 years that is called Mercado Libre, which is the biggest e-commerce platform in South America. So I think Mercado Libre has really led the way, and there is a lot of appetite for the automation due to the success of that e-commerce platform. And at the same time, is what we are always saying here, there’s a labour shortage all over. I think that the same thing as in Europe that makes that logistic companies are trying to automate a lot of their processes. So in America, there is no exception. It is no exception to that, and is actually investing quite a lot of money in bringing their processes up-to-date.

Of course, they are a couple of steps back from the automation levels here in Europe, but they are really pushing. And really, out of five, six interviews that I’m holding every week, for example, in Brazil, two or three are from logistics consultants firms that are really deep into big projects, actually, on automation. It’s just sorting lines, distribution centres, making the warehousing more efficient, warehousing systems, bigger distribution line, because the e-commerce is booming. And for example, for what Juan V. was saying, that is keeping the track really excellent, and keeping the tracking for their process, maybe they are not yet at this stage, but they are really picking up. And in terms of automation, Brazil is leading the way, but there is a lot of countries like Chile, Argentina, Colombia, Peru that are really investing quite a lot of money in bringing the processes up-to-date.

Patrick Daly:

Interesting. What I might do now is change direction slightly. So rather than ask you about business and business development, maybe ask you a little bit about your own personal and professional development. So this question goes to you, Juan V. What would you say is the most important life lesson that you have learned and that has stood to you throughout your career?

Juan Vicente Sanchís:

Okay, Patrick. I think that for personal reason, that my leitmotiv more or less is “Never give up.” And you always need to go ahead, because the life is not easier. And during my last 30 years, I think that I changed my business direction, my business way a lot of times. Sometimes because I wrong, sometimes because I need to change for other things, other question, but really, never give up. And I think that this is the best thing that one person can do, never give up or repeat.

Patrick Daly:

Excellent. And Juane E., you’re still with us, are you?

Juane Tudela:

I’m with you. Yeah, I’ve got to say that I was sitting at my terrace here at home, because it was nice and warm. And just from 10 minutes up to now, I think the temperature dropped by five degrees. So actually, I was putting on my sweater, because I was getting cold here.

Patrick Daly:

I wanted to ask you, so you’ve been successful in your professional life, but as we know, success is not a straight line, and everybody faces setbacks in their work and in their life. So how do you approach setbacks? What do you do? What do you think or what do you say to yourself to get yourself back on track?

Juane Tudela:

Yeah, that’s interesting, because this is a question that I’m just able to answer from, I think, not really a long time ago. I think it’s seeing your life with a perspective, because sometimes you see yourself where you are coming from or where you want to go, and keeping distance from the day-to-day. It’s sometimes difficult. That’s why you tend to overreact to things. For example, when there is something sad, or there is something that you may get too excited about. And overreacting is very easy. So to keep yourself normal, and being able to think, really, in where you are, I think perspective is the key. And that’s the sentence that is in English. I don’t think there is really a real translation into Spanish, but in English it’s “Never too high, never too low.” I just heard it. It’s a very stoic sentence. You never have to go overexcited for things when they are good or to overreact when things are bad. Just like-

Patrick Daly:

The Buddha spoke about the middle way.

Juane Tudela:

Exactly, exactly, exactly. Just keeping it calm, keeping it chill. And just work for what you want, and see where you’ve come from and see what you have achieved, and see how you’ve been doing. And surely, there’s never been anything okay with overreacting to things. So I think that is my way of doing.

Patrick Daly:

Excellent.

Juane Tudela:

But as I said, that’s due to perspective, because actually, I stumbled and I’ve fallen so many times, but now I think I can say it.

Patrick Daly:

Yeah, tell me about it.

Juane Tudela:

That is the thing.

Patrick Daly:

And Juan V., what do you like to do outside of work in your spare time? I think you might be on mute. You’re on mute.

Juan Vicente Sanchís:

Sorry about it. Okay. But really, now I have the opportunity to mix one or two of my passions. One of my passion is the mountain. I’m living inside of Alicante in new land, and we are around a lot of different mountains to walk. And my other passion is running. And to this way, I can try running, as running through the mountains. And really, I enjoy this hobby. And in fact, Juane E. and I, we have a team that we will run together in some ways. And really, is a good opportunity to talk about life, to talk about other things, and discuss too about work. Always, I enjoy having fun at the same time.

Patrick Daly:

Excellent. Maybe the next time I visit you, maybe you’ll take me running in the mountains as well.

Juan Vicente Sanchís:

Yeah.

Juane Tudela:

Yeah, more than invited. Really.

Patrick Daly:

So Juane E., are you currently reading or listening to anything inspiring at the moment that you’d recommend to listeners?

Juane Tudela:

Well, actually-

Patrick Daly:

Or recently?

Juane Tudela:

Yeah. I was talking about never too low, never too high. And actually, I wanted to read Tom Wolfe’s book, the Bonfire of the Vanities. And 10 pages later, I realised that I already read it a long time ago, and I’m enjoying it. I’m enjoying it again. I mean, Tom Wolfe is a great writer.

Patrick Daly:

What was the title? What was the title again?

Juane Tudela:

The Bonfire of the Vanities.

Patrick Daly:

Oh, the Bonfire of the Vanities. Excellent, yeah.

Juane Tudela:

Exactly, exactly, exactly. And actually, for the main character, I mean, it happens exactly the same. You can never put yourself too high or too low. Just put yourself in the middle, and have really a good distance between all that. Because the main character just was on the top, and then it fell off straight to the ground.

Patrick Daly:

Like Icarus.

Juane Tudela:

It is just coincidence. It’s just a coincidence, but it’s a great book.

Patrick Daly:

Excellent. Excellent. Well, many thanks, Juan Vicente and Juane Emilio, for being here with us today. It’s been an absolute pleasure to chat to you.

Juane Tudela:

No, thanks very much, Patrick. And good to be here on Interlinks.

Patrick Daly:

Excellent.

Juan Vicente Sanchís:

Thank you.

Patrick Daly:

Thanks also to our listeners for tuning in again today. And be aware that if you enjoyed this episode, you can find the full series of nearly 140 episodes of Interlinks on Spotify, Apple Podcasts, Acast, and other major podcast platforms. So until next time, keep well and stay safe.